However, you will be able to take that large game over a variety of distances. Recoil impacts your comfort, your ability to fire a second shot quickly, and especially your ability to shoot the gun accurately. I watched through a binocular as the guides first shot struck in shallow water behind him, while his second shot caught the moose too far back and had little effect. Im still on the fence about using Hornadys values instead of straight ft lbs of power. The first to be introduced was .26 Nosler, followed by .28 Nosler, .30 Nosler, .33 Nosler, .22 Nosler, and .27 Nosler. While the .26 Nosler and the .28 Nosler share the same cartridge case dimensions, the .30 Nosler has a slightly shorter length to the shoulder dimension than the .26 Nosler and the .28 Nosler,[7] and the .33 Nosler has a shorter shoulder length dimension than that of the .30 Nosler. Jim Harmer is a host of the Backfire Youtube channel. Out of the muzzle, the .28 Nosler is flying 475 ft/s faster than the .308 Winchester. Some of these have been very successful commercially with hunters and match shooters and with various militaries, but for several reasons others have struggled. Why? One thing I did learn from this is how light the 6.5 creedmoors recoil was. Thanks! Thank you and love yalls content! Your email address will not be published. Where does the recoil of a 12 gauge shotgun fit in? If I were to get a 338 I would probably rebarrel a m70 Featherweight. Selecting a rifle and cartridge combination which does not produce too much recoil for the shooters is critical to being able to shoot accurately without developing a flinch. Looking at mark v hunter. For the best experience on our site, be sure to turn on Javascript in your browser. Mag, so it's a good thing the barrels are threaded to accept a muzzle . To comply with the new e-Privacy directive, we need to ask for your consent to set the cookies. Using my Howa Alpine Mountain rifle in 308 win. Due to its greater length, the Remington case is about 25 percent more capacious than the Nosler.[17]. In a well-designed rifle and stock, the .30-06 recoil is acceptable for most adult shooters, but in many older rifles with poorly-designed stocks, the recoil can feel too powerful. This is fascinating. Initial factory loads will include the 9.7g (150gr) AccuBond and the 10.7g (165gr) AccuBond Long Range (ABLR) bullets. What is the felt recoil (recoil velocity) of a reduced recoil Hornady 125 grain SST (Custom Lite) load? loved the info was very helpful, literally a life saver. Due to its efficient case design, including a shorter powder column and 35-degree shoulder, and careful selection of powders to optimize velocities, it burns around 18 percent less powder than the .338 Lapua Magnum while achieving similar velocities. The company claims there's no upper impact velocity limit for the E-Tip bullet and that it'll . As I stressed in my earlier piece, there are no free lunches in physics: the 33 Noslers power comes at a price in-terms of recoil. If so, how much recoil reduction might be realized by using semi autos? The 6.5 PRC generates 16.27 ft-lbs of energy at a recoil velocity of 11.19 fps. I did not see the Hornady HITS Ranking in the table. They chose .333-inch bullets because .338-inch .33 Winchester bullets were too light and gave poor performance on big game when pushed to O.K.H. A broad butt and comb help spread the recoil over a greater area of your shoulder and face for added comfort. Both are great choices for long range shooting, . An additional method to reduce the recoil of a firearm is to use downloaded rounds. The .22 Nosler is a SAAMI approved and standardized cartridge. RELATED: 6.5 Creedmoor vs. .308 Winchester. Mag. Here are a couple of Cartridges that would make for some Interesting Videos in the Future . For those of you who are new to firearms, lets discuss the basics of what recoil is before we look at the data. 2) may run into an overall length or case capacity issues with the longer bullets. Hey Jim just wanted to tell you that I love the channel.. very informative about not only what rifle options are best for our budget but what caliber might be best for our needs. The choice of caliber will really come down to your needs. Rated 5.00 out of 5 $ 215.54 Add to cart; Nosler Unprimed Brass 243 Win (50) Often three shots would cluster in a single ragged hole that was easily under .5 inch, but twice the fourth round opened the group to around .75 inch, which was shooter error. If you want to go between larger game and deer, the .308 Winchester might have a bit more versatility without blasting your smaller game to pieces. At 300 yards, that advantage has expanded to 603 ft/s, as the .308 Winchester starts to lose its velocity faster. You see, I once wrote a piece for this very website titled "Who Needs a Magnum?" Throughout shooting sessions, the trigger broke cleanly at 2 34 pounds. Some that come to mind are the .243, 25-06, and 7mm-08. Most hunters arent hunting elk, moose, bears or eland, though, and those animals can weigh several times more than the average whitetail. The following ballistics tables show a side by side comparison of the 28 Nosler vs 308 Winchester based on bullet weight and performance metrics including velocity, energy, usage and recoil. 3. They work on grizzlies at close range but can reach out to put down a wounded moose at long range.. Ballistically, the 30 Nosler is going to win most of the time at the expense of a relatively small amount of extra powder and barrel life. Even with foam earplugs or earmuffs, the sound can still be loud enough to make ears ring. 35 remington 358 winchester 35 whelen 35 whelen ack 350 rem mag (no fit) 358 . Well, no one needs oneit has been proven over and over again that one can just about hunt the world with a .270 or a .30-06 with good bullets so long as we arent going after the bigger half of the big five. 60 years later, and 28 Nosler created in 2014, around 70-74 years after Roy's. I just pulled up some factory loads for the three and just wanted to show the difference in 70 years of development. The 300 PRC has a maximum pressure of 62,000 psi, which is about average for a magnum cartridge. How can we calculate wind drift for these calibers? The bulk you just have to resize and check length before you load . It is a push-feed system with a countersunk bolt face, rotating extractor and plunger ejector. As yet, no one offers a 250 grain AccuBond in factory ammo for the 33 Nosler, and it would have scored closer to the .338 RUM with a 250. Short Belted and .334 O.K.H. Also, just curious, are you gathering these w/ basic common variables? Just recognize that its going to push you a loteven though it wont be painful. The .33 Nosler is Nosler's fourth cartridge following its predecessors the .26 Nosler which was released in 2014, the .28 Nosler which was released in 2015, and the .30 Nosler which was released in 2016. Factory .33 Nosler ammunition loaded with 225-grain AccuBond bullets measures 3.324 inches, which allows it to function in standard .30-06 length actions. It is implied, but you're right in that it should have been emphasized . During the spring conservation order, you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan. It makes so an old man can understand it. Hope yall enjoy it! any ways. So, in the spirit of consistency, who needs a .33 Nosler? The .28 Nosler is basically only appropriate for the biggest game in North America. The Old Timers will get it right away . A premium action requires a premium barrel. Nosler Custom 338Win 24.75" Walnut w/Leupold Limited Edition The .334 O.K.H. It only makes sense: the .28 Nosler will stay supersonic past 1,700 yards, while the .308 Winchester will stay supersonic until the 800-900 yard range. The .28 Nosler will often be chambered in more expensive precision hunting rifles, but there is a good selection of .28 Nosler rifles despite the less available ammunition. Efficiency appears to be a hallmark of the .33 Nosler, as it is said to beat the velocity of the .338 Lapua Magnum while burning 18 percent less powder. The higher magnification settings make it suitable for taking game in open country where longer shots can be expected. Personally, I hate muzzle brakes and dont use them at all anymore. Should have some 265gr ABLR coming soon and see what they yield. The .308 Winchester is a popular cartridge, which means it is readily available in most ammunition stores from a variety of top manufacturers. Is there a specific suppressor you would recommend for this rifle? Now I am better informed and will make better decisions regarding what to buy and stock up on. The .28 Nosler is considered an excellent long-range hunting cartridge, while the .308 Winchester is intended to stay within smaller ranges to take down its larger prey. People who have actually shot a .50BMG usually report mild recoil similar to a .308 Winchester. I have taken a considerable number of big game with .338s, including elk, moose, black bear, caribou, deer, pronghorn antelope, grizzly and Alaskan brown bears and have also used them in long-range target work at distances out to 2,000 yards. The .28 Nosler is a belted magnum cartridge that uses a small rifle primer. They also played a vital role in introducing .338-caliber cartridges to shooters and hunters around the world and filled the obvious performance gap between the .30- and .375-caliber magnum cartridges. Both cartridges kick fairly hard, but the 300 win mag has more velocity behind it. [16], The .30 Nosler was released in January 2016. Youll need to stay inside 300 yards for large game, and inside 500 yards for medium game. Out of the muzzle, the .28 Nosler is traveling with 955 ft-lbs over the .308 Winchester a significant difference. [9] The .26 Nosler, when loaded with 8.4g (129gr) AccuBond Long Range very-low-drag bullets, retains as much velocity at 370m (400yd) as the .260 Remington produces at the muzzle. Muzzle Brake & Flash Hider Caliber Fit Guide. The .26 and .28 Noslers share the same case dimensions except for the neck being sized to accept respective bullet diameters, but the .30 Nosler case has the shoulder datum moved back to a shorter dimension. The extra power of the .28 Nosler is necessary if so. The sharp, 35-degree shoulder and fat case offer a lot of room for propellant, and the maximum cartridge overall length (COL) of 3.34 inches means it will fit in a standard .30-06-length action. Thanks a million for your time and unbiased information, Im curious Jim. As hunting cartridges, both of these calibers are popular in bolt action rifles. The 30 Nosler and 300 Winchester Magnum are two very popular cartridges for hunters. One could even make the case that heading into dangerous game country to hunt non-dangerous game warrants a big gun with big bullets in-case of an unintentional encounter. Using preproduction ammunition, muzzle velocity averaged 3,099 fps from the 26-inch barrel of the Nosler Model 48 Patriot rifle. It feels more like a sudden vibration than actual kick. I have considerable respect for the capabilities of this caliber. Mag. The Ridgeline is the quintessential hunting rifle. Appreciate the hours of hard work . His chestnut face had the trademark forehead hump of a big, mature bull. The .33 Nosler is already SAAMI approved and has a maximum average pressure of 65,000 psi. Will you be pursuing the toughest game in North America? The .50BMG produces a tremendous amount of recoil, measuring at 83.17 ft-lbs of energy. That's 275 fps faster than the 338 Win Mag using the same length action and 25 fps faster than the 338 Lapua at the muzzle while burning 18% less powder. Great data! Thanks. Contributor Brad Fenson takes to the grill, to cook up some delicious venison burgers. Just want to make sure Im reading it correctly. In this case, either cartridge will help you get your target, and the lighter recoil of the .308 Winchester might be a welcome relief. The .33 Nosler, the largest of the group, gives hunters significantly-increased velocities over the .338 Win. My preferred method for reducing recoil is using a silencer (suppressor, if you will). My experience with a variety of .338 cartridges began in the 1970s, which in the decades since has included all the abovementioned cartridges, as well as several proprietary and wildcat variants. 225 gr. With that, there was mention that for deer the cartridge should have Hornady HITS ranking of at least 500 and for elk 900. Rated 4.50 out of 5 $ 41.99 - $ 152.42 Select options; Hornady Brass Unprimed 376 Steyr (50) Rated 5.00 out of 5 $ 76.99 Add to cart; . Introduced in 2016 (production release 2017), the .33 Nosler . Nosler produces six different hunting cartridges. The same is true with guns. For the next 20 rounds, it was cleaned after every five shots. Other notable features include a two-position safety, hinged floorplate, one-piece firing pin and an adjustable Rifle Basix trigger. . The new Nosler Model 21 is a feature-rich production firearm that has the feel and performance of a custom build. most is oh it feels like a ( insert rifle caliber here) i know im shooting a inline with 60 grains of pyrodex and a 250 grain bullet out of a 10 lb rifle, it feels like my 3030 but i have no way of knowing if im risking my life with the recoil. After a couple of fouling shots, it was ready to be tested for accuracy. Regardless, thank you for all your work. Why not offer Patreon support since YouTube demonetized your channel? This can reduce the recoil between 20% and 50% depending on the size and effectiveness of the brake. To better understand and appreciate the .338s potency at long distance on big game, I can recall an Alaskan hunter who gut-shot a large bull moose with a big-bore, bolt-action rifle at less than 100 yards, missed his second shot and then severely scope-cut his forehead with his third shot and was unable to shoot again. [16], The .28 Nosler is essentially a shortened version of the 7mm Remington Ultra Magnum (7mm RUM). One thing Id like to ask is, if you still have the info handy, could you please add the rifle weight you used for each of the calculations so we could have an idea to expect more/less felt recoil with our rifle selections? In rough figures, this is around 175 to 250 fps faster than the .338 Winchester Magnum with the same bullet weight and barrel length, but also easily exceeds the .338 Remington Ultra Mag and is similar to the .338 Lapua while using approximately 18 percent less powder. Overall, thanks again for the work and please publish the data with straight ft lbs instead of the Hornady math as well. It features a beltless case, functions in standard length actions, is powder efficient, accurate and offers impressive velocities. This means that the momentum of a rifle's reaction will exactly equal the momentum of the bullet and powder gasses ejected from the barrel. This is a really epic resource! Thank you for pointing it out. Long Belted was based on the full-length .300 H&H Magnum case blown out and necked to accept .333-inch bullets and was easily the most potent of the three cartridges. The classic-style, synthetic stock (a proprietary blend of Kevlar and other lightweight synthetic materials) features aluminum pillars and is Marine Tex bedded. It has very similar recoil to the 7mm-08, and slightly less than the .270 Winchester. The CDS (Custom Dial System) can be custom tailored at no cost to correspond with the precise ballistics of a given load to compensate for bullet drop. During testing, extreme spreads were an impressive 30 fps for a 10-shot string. The success of the 26 Nosler led to an expansion in the lineup and now we have the 28 Nosler (7mm), 30 Nosler (.30 caliber), and the .33 Nosler (.338) to choose from. Like other Nosler cartridges, the case is based loosely on the beltless .404 Jeffery case, which offers magnum capacity and performance. God Bless America , The Constitution , Bill Of Rights & The U.S. Warriors & Veterans Of The United States Of America. Remove from Compare Add to Compare. According to Nosler's handloading manual, 71.5 grains of H4831 powder should nudge that bullet from a 24-inch barrel at 2,780 fps. This efficient new cartridge rivals the velocity and energy of the proven .338 Lapua Magnum while using significantly less powder. Howdy JimI noticed on your recoil chart.that you have the 300 Win mag 11 notches higher on the totem polethan the 338 Win mag..can this be true ??? I want this to be perfect. These charts have been eye opening and informative, thank you. Thank you for all the work! I would support you. as a person that cant have more the 15 foot lbs recoil going into my shoulder ( medical thing ) i find this very helpfull. Maximum case lengths are 72.4mm (2.850in) and 65.8mm (2.590in) respectively. Multiple sources that Ive read say it is around 30 ft/lbs. Thats 275 fps faster than the 338 Win Mag using the same length action and 25 fps faster than the 338 Lapua at the muzzle while burning 18% less powder. based on the .30-06 case necked to accept .333-caliber Jeffery bullets weighing up to 300 grains. Thanks Jim. Also, how hard would it be to add a 12 and 20 gauge sabot slug to the work? Appreciate the podcast. X-Vision Optics long-range ImpactThermal Scope (TS300) boasts a 640 x 480 thermal sensor that can detect big game well past 3,000 yards. The .28 Nosler is also typically quite a bit pricier, and youll likely have to pay more for a nice rifle chambered in it as well. The 33 Nosler is capable of propelling a 225gr AccuBond at 3025 fps and the brand new 265gr AccuBond Long Range at 2775 fps. If you are a serious elk hunter, the .33 Nosler would be hard to beat. One way to think about this is as such: a foot-pound is a unit of energy equal to the amount of energy required to raise a weight of one pound a distance of one foot. He was on the ground within five seconds of the first shot and never took a step. What is your rationale for momentum of powder charge = mass X 1.75 X muzzle velocity? As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 8. Copyright 2023Sportsman's Warehouse. It generates 21.34 ft-lbs of energy at 12.55 fps. I have spent literally hundreds of hours collecting the information in this blog post. Long Belted wildcat cartridges and the .338 Winchester and .340 Weatherby cartridges cannot be ignored. At 300 yards, that advantage breaks into four digits at 1,020 ft-lbs more of a punch for the .28 Nosler. Suppose a giant, heavy semi-truck is parked in front of you with your shoulder on the bumper. Additionally, if youll be shooting elk-sized game within 300 yards, the added recoil might just not be worth it for power that you wont really be using. The bullet looks like it came out of an advertisement and retained 223.8 grains of its weight, which must mean that the polymer tip weighed 1.2 grains. You explain yourself very well . When taking game at longer distances, the .338 magnums boast considerable downrange energy that produce reliable results. The bore was then cleaned after every three shots for the next 15 shots. Recoil Velocity = (Powder charge in grains * 1.75 + bullet weight in grains) * muzzle velocity in FPS / weight of gun in lbs / 7000gr. Have you, or could you , review rifle availability for left handers? Will you be shooting elk-sized game at longer distances? One item I remain curious about is where the 12 gauge shotgun cartridge fits. At 500 yards, the .28 Nosler maintains an advantage of 992 ft-lbs. Sorry, I love Hornady ammo, but marketing is still marketing. I was wondering why I never see anyone do videos on one of the greatest calibers of all time.. the 8 x57 Mauser. Just a more useful cartridge to me all the way around. The 26 Nosler is a 6.5mm/.264" cartridge based on the beltless .404 Jeffery case and the round was an instant hit. Mag. The most common method that shooters choose is to simply add a muzzle brake. After surveying the Backfire audience, we found that 96% of shots on big game are taken within 500 yards. i know its different, i used to shoot 45-70 and id shoot black powder loads and modern powder loads and the black powder loaded ones felt alot better, way less recoil. It produces 28.27 ft-lbs of recoil energy at a velocity of 14.72 fps. The .224 Valkyrie is a similar cartridge, but the two are not interchangeable. So it would apply to deer or elk. In the shooting sports we call that reaction recoil or "kick." With the 225-grain AccuBond the .33 Nosler will deliver the same trajectory as the .300 Winchester Magnum with a 180-grain bullet. . I see sportsmans guide pulled down the plagiarized article from their site. Christensen Arms. The 33 Nosler is capable of propelling a 225gr AccuBond at 3025 fps and the brand new 265gr AccuBond Long Range at 2775 fps. 105. I have gone in and fixed the error. Choosing a cartridge will essentially depend on the ranges you intend to shoot well go through several important factors to help you determine which cartridge is right for you. Double checked my info and I can confirm its correct. Disclaimer: Sportsman's Warehouse assumes no responsibility or liability for any errors or omissions of the information on this page. You mentioned Weatherby rifles because of stock design helps with recoil! Jim, Although we strive to provide the most accurate information as we can the information contained in this page is provided on an "as is" basis with no guarantees of completeness, accuracy, usefulness or timeliness. A radial-port brake has holes all around the sides which can make it more effective, but sends out a blast of dust when shot near the ground because it blasts down and not just to the sides. Nosler has built quite a cartridge family, and it continues to grow. Many smaller-bodied or inexperienced adult shooters begin to experience flinch at approximately 11.75 fps of recoil velocity. I really like your YouTube channel, This got me started, but I found your formula confusing because of the way it is written out. RCBS reloading dies are also currently available for the cartridge. The .28 Nosler is a more select cartridge, and while it isnt difficult to find, it wont be quite as readily available. If you had to choose from left-handed choice, what would be good, better, best picks? Great job Jim! Backfire LLC owns and operates this website. I like the little 308, but I think the 280 pretty much smokes it all the way around. Earlier I was getting 3025 fps with the 225gr nosler E-tip with 84 gr 4831sc. Without the 8 mm Mauser there would be no 30-06 or 308 or any other cartridges that have that head size. The trend has been that the more potent versions are those gaining in popularity. I hunted sheep in Alaska this fall and Ill admit that my little Kimber .308 felt pretty small when we were stepping over grizzly tracks in the alder-choked river bottoms. After shooting a lot of different rifles and cartridges, I have found that recoil velocity number accurately predicts how much pain youll feel, and the recoil energy predicts how much youll get rocked back and thrown off your target in the scope. I have tried many different methods for reducing the recoil of cartridges that are too powerful. look forward to black powder list one day. SJB358":oa2xyivx said: This is easy, the 280! While the .26 Nosler and the .28 Nosler share the same cartridge case dimensions, the .30 Nosler has a slightly shorter length to the shoulder dimension than the .26 Nosler and the .28 Nosler,[7] and the .33 Nosler has a shorter shoulder dimension yet than that of the .30 Nosler. The 33 Nosler is capable of propelling a 225gr AccuBond at 3025 fps and the brand new 265gr AccuBond Long Range at 2775 fps. [2], The .26 Nosler (6.566mmRB) is a rebated-rim centerfire rifle cartridge designed by Nosler and first announced in November 2013. The .26 Nosler is designed as a modern 6.5mm cartridge, using recent advances in firearm technology to attain exceptionally high muzzle velocities, up to 1,040m/s (3,400ft/s), and maintain an extremely flat trajectory. The .33 Nosler would be an absolute hammer on large African plains game including eland, zebra, wildebeest and kudu. Follow along to see exactly how. Because of its recoil, a .28 Nosler should generally only be shot out of heavier rifles, coupled with a brake or suppressor. It is commonly called a guns kick. More recoil is created when more powerful powder loads and lighter-weight firearms are used. Great information. In January 2017 Nosler introduced the .22 Nosler. I stand by everything I wrote in that article, with the caveat that powerful cartridges are useful in certain roles if the hunter can learn to shoot them well. The throats and cartridge overall lengths of their SAAMI design chambers are too short. 8.6 blackout (new!) . Lu, Sooo Glad that youve decided to Bypass these Anti-Second Amendment Attacks . Your chart says 6.8 Western produces 20ft/lbs of recoil but a couple other sites Ive read say its around 30. velocities, and they had a much lower ballistic coefficient than desired. A silencer can reduce a firearms recoil up to 45% while also making the gunshot quieter.